Tonal Telepathy

Melody-wise they are so much in harmony and their play’s so tight that the Red Hot Chili Peppers once again can only be measured by their own standards. Using his instrument, their guitar-Picasso John Frusciante shows us where to find the magic of playing with bassist Flea and tells us why the new songs of the ‘Californication’ follow-up ‘By the Way’ will deepen the cult surrounding the band.

One has been invited: In order to promote the Chili Pepper’s next mega-seller, their record company has come up with something special: An open air gig on the top parking deck of Hamburg’s Saturn shopping mall. While the lights of the night descend on the city’s rooftops and a soft summer breeze is around, the four Californians enter the stage which has been erected especially for this occasion. They pick up their instruments and reassuringly nod towards each other before the send a mix of songs from their new album and hits such as ‘Scar Tissue’, ‘Give It Away’, ‘I Could Have Lied’ or ‘Californication’ into the night. Even though this being a promo-gig and despite the abundance of PR-nerds this so-called ‘showcase’ is for many fans and some journos like a movie. So much interaction between the band members, so much blind understanding and so much wonderful music.

The morning after John Frusciante shows up for the interview at the Hyatt explaining that his hair is wet cause he’s been swimming and his eyes light up as he sees the little Vox Cambridge 15 Amp and the Fender Strat we set up for him. He quickly orders some coffee and lunch and sits down next to the guitar.

Seeing you guys on stage just like last night, it is again and again fascinating to see how much interaction there is between you and how tight your play is ­ especially between you and Flea.
Watching each other has always played an important role for us. It is fun to concentrate on the other person’s fingers and his play while playing something completely different yourself. The most important connection to someone you’re making music with is taking place subconsciously in the back of your head. You think and play towards the same direction, no matter whether you look at each other while doing so or not.

You once said that besides finding your own style you also found the ‘best fitting style of playing guitar in connection with Flea playing bass’…
Way back when I joined the band and when we were recording ‘Mother’s Milk’ [1989] the producers pushed me into this metal-funk department and I therefore played mainly hard riffs on the lower e-string. That didn’t really come from the heart, however, in those days it seemed to be a good idea. Althoug I’m not too proud of ‘Mother’s Milk’. it is probably our most influential album. At least back then a lot of people jumped at it. In some instances we simultaneously put five distorted guitar tracks and a piercing solo on top of the bass. When the ‘Mother’s Milk’ tour was over and we started working on ‘Blood Sugar Sex Magik’ [1991] I consciously decided to aim at playing behind Flea, keeping my sound clean and using my distortion pedal only for solos. I wanted to keep my solos as minimal as possible and wanted to play in a more spatial way ­ I wanted to create more room. The guitarists that I then considered to be good models were Matthew Ashman of Bow Wow Wow, who’s also playing with a rather ‘busy’ bass guitarist, and Andy Sumner of The Police. I considered myself more and more as support for Flea and Chad. This way I discovered exactly what I’m good at. And the most fascinating thing about it was this: Since I began to retreat from the foreground, creativity simply started to pour out of me thus automatically putting me into the fore at the same time ­ however in a deeper way. Flea on the other hand also became more simple, more delicate and useful for me to play with. Somehow everyone in the band suddenly took off into this direction. Meanwhile all of this is so well-developed and steady between us that I don’t have to think about it at all ­ for me things just flow.

In a way both of you play melodies and rhythms which perfectly melt into one. How do they come into existence?
It is good to display opposites. I remember a good exercise we did during the time of ‘Blood Sugar’ to practice playing together. While Flea played a complex funky and syncopated rhythm I tried to fill the holes with chords and to kind of play in between Flea. . I think it is important to create new rhythms. If someone plays something and you want to join the jam you should try to find a different rhythm, one that is part of what the other plays and that supports whatever he started out with. This way you create something completely new. Sometimes we play harmonies that suit each other and sometimes we play stuff that is totally apart.

During the intro to ‘By The Way’ we both play exactly the same rhythm but are adding different notes. The combination of this produces a double stop, which in itself implies chords. I don’t have a clue which ones. We simply face each other and listen ­ just like Fugazi who often come up with chords in which guitar and bass play different notes.

Are all of your songs created like this, by jamming and listening?
Most of them are. Sometimes I bring the entire guitar parts for a song along and the others add their parts ­ we did this for example with ‘Venice Queen’, ‘Cabron’ or ‘I Could Die For You’. Things such as duration or arrangement are of course developed by all of us together. ‘This Is The Place’ and ‘Don’t Forget Me’ are jam session songs and do sound like the sessions during which they came around. During those jams Flea played the same bass line for over half an hour and I tried various guitar parts on top of it. Flea loves it to put himself into a hypnotic groove. I join in and as soon as he has caught me I will play one part after the other ­ each one giving Flea’s bass line a completely different flavour. Those songs don’t sound like the bass is playing the same part all the time, but he does.

Which role does Anthony play in writing songs?
We generally develop songs as a band. Sometimes we record our jam sessions. Anthony goes through those tapes and a week or a month later he presents us bits and pieces of those tapes going “This groove is hot. We should write a song around it.” We write tons of stuff and when Anthony dances across the room doing his moves it feels great.

When you bring ideas of your own to sessions often these ideas are influenced by other guitarists. Which of your heroes were responsible this time?
I can’t really put it down for this one. The songs in ‘Blood Sugar’ are easier to sort out. When working on ‘Breaking The Girl’ I listened a lot to Led Zeppelin. I especially liked ‘Friends’. I also played a 12-string back them. That’s where the idea to ‘Breaking The Girl’ came from. I took the chords of the chorus from the book on Duke Ellington. I tried to learn one song form this book and played three chords of a song which has at least 50 chords. Based on these three chords and some additional stuff I wrote our song. ‘Give It Away’ contains elements of Black Sabbath’s ‘Sweet Leaf’. Back then you could have questioned me on every single guitar part and I could have told you the source and the development of it. It’s not quite like this anymore. But anyway, I did draw a lot of inspiration from other music and imagined to comprise the style of some of my favourite guitarists in my work.

Which are?
Johnny Marr of The Smiths, for example, Siouxie & The Banshees, Matthew Ashman of Bow Wow Wow or Bernard Sumner of New Order and Joy Division ­ none of those were great guitarists, technically speaking, but they stood out due to their individual way of playing, something that makes them unique. But wait ­ the more I think about it, the more influences come to my mind. For example, a song by Nightmares on Wax, I think, which is on some Warped compilation. You find it in ‘Time’, which is a b-side on the first single. When I pinch from others it’s important to either take the technical aspect or the feeling, but never both at the same time. If you develop this further from there adding your own signature, you will put enough distance between you and the original. I never aimed at being original, I just happened to stumble into it.

How did this hard funky riff in ‘Can’t Stop’ happen?
This is definitely influenced by Ricky Wilson, the B-52’s guitarist. He died around 1985 ­ one of my heroes. He took off the d and g strings and tuned the upper strings to the same note. He considered the low and the high strings as two separate things and often played them simultaneously into two opposite directions. It’s a simple way for him to give the impression of using two guitars. This is exactly what I tried on ‘Can’t Stop’. The high notes move back and forth while the lower ones change chords.

Can’t you hear this ‘two guitars in one’ thing on ‘Venice Queen’, right?
Yes, exactly!

On ‘Don’t Forget Me’ Flea plays the basic chords while you play a legato lick on your White Falcon.
No, no, I only used the Gretsch for the show yesterday. The guitar almost solely used on ‘By The Way’ is my ’62 Strat. The White Falcon was only used on ‘Tear’. But you are right concerning this lick. Because of Anthony singing over it and me using a delay it’s developing a great effect in the background. The delay is used during the entire song. I tuned it to triplet, which adds a lot of tempo to my lick. In the 70’s you could have used that as a solo, but I use it to colour the stanza.

You used a Marshall yesterday, a guitar and a bass top at the same time.
Yes, I do that all the time ­ live as well as in the studio. And also a Fender Spring Reverb from the 50’s.

Sounds like Vintage Spirit!
I love vintage, especially guitars. The folks form Fender asked me if I wanted to build my own signature model. I was really honoured but I refused this offer. These old guitars and their parts are perfect, as far as I’m concerned I couldn’t have improved that.

Could it be that you are playing more solos these days?
I think so. Not on purpose, but more and more little melodies and solos sneak in.

Your solo style depends rather on melody than on technique
That’s the reason why I can get so many of the in. During our rehearsals I did consciously try to play as little blues as possible. Even after I had quit the band, had not played for years and being completely out of practice ­ blues did work out anytime. I really wanted a different approach: During the entire ‘Californication’ tour I learned how to transfer 80’s style synthesizer melodies for guitar ­ like Kraftwerk. On their records from the 70’s I found some very pleasant, simple melodies with a special flair, melodies which seemed in no way to be connected with blues. I had found a new sound and learned other synthesizer melodies, like stuff by Depeche Mode who, for example, gave my way of playing a completely new perspective On stage I played my good old Jimmy Page-like riffs, cause this is where I come from and this was exactly what the songs demanded A lot of our songs are somewhere based on these funky-bluesy stories. On good nights I could play my Kraftwerk melodies on top of the old songs, but it never melted perfectly. But as soon as we started working on new material I wanted to stick with the idea and didn’t want to retire to the old riffs. I didn’t want to play melodies like a guitarist anymore, but wanted to develop some that would not remind me of what guitarists normally do when playing a solo. I was also influenced by Surf guitarists such as Duane Eddy and the Shadows from the early 60’s. But I also didn’t pay too much attention to them when they moved into their solos. I was rather interested in their melodies found in their instrumentals. One of the few guitarists whose solos I would always listen to was George Harrison. His solos were always wonderful melodies and very intelligent. He always kept the chord changes in the back of his mind and played on top of them in a very clever and tasteful fashion. Before this album I did have a very good look at George Harrison because I wanted to understand why he plays the way he does and what he does and how he plays around those chords. I just don’t want to simply learn other people’s technique in order to hear that in their work. I want to think about why someone chose exactly the notes he’s playing. And that meant that I have to listen to the bass and get to know the underlying chords in order to consider their effects.

You speak of colours when you talk about playing guitar. How do you go about concerning tone colour?
Thinking of colours instead of mechanical sequences on the frets it something that originates in my love for painting.

Did you start painting during your long break?
I actually began to paint while working on ‘Blood Sugar’. Just for fun that is. I imagined using the guitar as a brush. There are invisible colours in the shape of emotions in your head whose vibrations you can adapt to your style. My break, however, was under a different star. When I decided to become addicted to heroin, I felt better and my depressions gave way. I wanted to spend my life letting go and being only responsible for my own well-being ­ I didn’t want to spend a thought on what the outside world would think of me. I have been invisible for years and I did enjoy it very much ­ due to this time I am now a ‘richer’ person. I wanted to increase my love for painting and wanted to understand pictures better. I admire painters for their way of self-expression. At some stage I noticed that I do the same on my guitar.

How do you transfer this idea of painting into music?
That’s hard to describe. Maybe I’ll give a very simple example: When your bass guitarist plays something very hard, very fast and you are joining in also playing hard and fast, then this will not trigger any special feeling in your head. But if you play something simple and spacious, you will see that a feeling develops, a feeling that is totally different from what happened when listening to the bass line for the first time. Maybe it’s this way of putting things side by side, this kind of harmony that I mean when I speak of colours. If you look at a collage by Max Ernst you will find different textures next to each other. These aspects can be transferred to music. Things like a perspective where you can see something clearly in the background and where the foreground is blurry. In music this means that things don’t have to be straight all the time to make sense and to work out. The individual elements can be completely different from each other and yet they can harmonize.

You always say that in the Chili Peppers you depend on each other. Would you give an example of the effect of you and Flea playing together?
Hmm, that’s difficult. If Flea were here, I could show you that I do actually play stuff all the time that doesn’t make sense without the bass. Let’s see .

The two of you seem to like switching roles.
Oh yes. This is very important when you are playing with someone. If the other has an idea, you shouldn’t just add something that is like this idea. You have to play something opposed to what the other does. I guess that Flea and I have to advantage that whatever we play works out quite well. Even if I try to disagree with him musically things blend in perfectly and disagreeing makes it then even more colourful.

If ordinary persons try to play your songs in a rehearsal room, they will notice how difficult it is.
Maybe. But that is not the point. As a teenager I completely overestimated what a band needs from me. I tried to remember all this complicated Frank Zappa stuff. When I joined the Chili Peppers, I had too much technique up my sleeve. Even though I could master the most complicated rhythms, I had never heard of the “lay back and push” principle, and this concerning the band as a whole. In none of the guitar magazines I was reading at that time this was mentioned. So I sat in the studio and the producer said: “John, you gotta lay back, you’re pushing to hard.” or “John, you’re laying too far back, you gotta push harder.” Oh, sorry, drummers had been talking about this ­ Ian Paice [Deep Purple] and Ringo Starr. Everyone who’s playing with others will get into this situation. We all have to move to the groove. Either you’re playing precisely the basic pace or you’re playing ahead of it or you’re far behind. The basic beat stays the same. It depends on how you push it or how you’re laying back on it. If you manage this as a band, you’ll get an absolutely solid groove. A good example for a song being really pushed is ‘The Song Remains The Same’ by Led Zeppelin. Also the stanza in ‘Don’t Forget Me’ is rather laid back, whereas we’re pushing it in the chorus. I can remember how I was in the rehearsal room with the others for the very first time playing Hendrix’ ‘Fire’, ‘Purple Haze’ and ‘Foxy Lady’ or ‘Jeff’s Blues’ by the Yardbirds. None of us pushed at the same time. I pushed briefly and then laid back, after hat someone else pushed before he laid back. [laughs]

The Artist’s Studio

Everything’s Marshall: Live as well as in the studio John counts on a combination of a bass and an e-guitar top. For the Californication tour is were a 200 Watts bass top called Major (named model 1978), built between ’67 and ’74, as well as a Jubilee 25/50 guitar top. When recording the very same album, he used ­ as he says himself ­ a same bass top model and a 65′ guitar top. Everything by Marshall.

Everything’s Fender: John is known as an absolute Strat fanatic. Mostly he’s surrounded by a 62′, in rare cases he’s been sighted with a ’55, various Teles, a Jaguar or even a Gretsch White Falcon. His guitar for practice and travelling is a Mustang. Acoustically he’s counting on Martin, even though you can hear a Taylor on the more Spanish sounding songs on the album.

John himself describes his love for Fenders like this: If you’re looking for a full heavy metal or punk sound it’s not necessarly a Fender you’d want. But as far as I am concerned ­ I do hardly play any powerchords and therefore don’t need the rock guitar sound. I do stress the spatial aspect when playing, mostly with a clear sound. Clean as it is, a Fender can open so many worlds. I seems to me as if a Les Paul doesn’t contain such a broad variety as a clean Strat or Tele. You can get to many different moods out of them, so many different colours. I love this detail and the sparseness of this thin, clean sound with the hard attack and bite.

—Lars Thielke